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Re: [OM] Topaz Denoise as a sharpening tool (was "Adobe bringing Gigapix

Subject: Re: [OM] Topaz Denoise as a sharpening tool (was "Adobe bringing Gigapixel type function...")
From: Moose <olymoose@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2021 14:08:51 -0700
On 3/27/2021 5:51 AM, Wayne Shumaker wrote:
At 3/26/2021 03:33 PM, Moose wrote:
On 3/26/2021 11:29 AM, DZDub wrote:
On Fri, Mar 26, 2021 at 8:30 AM DZDub <jdubikins@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Fri, Mar 26, 2021 at 12:52 AM Moose <olymoose@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

The one piece that I mention often is the "sharpening" effect on low ISO
images (Defined here, with contemporary
cameras, as below 800.) of Topaz Denoise AI. As no one ever responds,
positive or negative, perhaps they don't believe
me, don't care . . . ?

One of a few examples I've posted.
I don't know yet what the different levels of Denoise in your labels mean,
but they all seem to have some "clarity" effect.
Denoise AI has three Modes, Denoise AI, Clear AI and Low Light. That's what the 
shorthand is about; the numbers are the slider settings.

I like that effect and it
does genuinely seem to sharpen -- and more subtly than FM.  It seems to
emerge from the image in an organic fashion.
Magic, I say, Magic!

It's puzzling because it seems more significant than any NR in play.
As I wrote just now, probably an unintended consequence.

I wouldn't have been looking for NR based on the quality of the original image.
I do a lot of stuff like LCE and other tools that tend to exacerbate even very 
modest noise.

Lets face it, even an A7 II at 100 ISO has some noise, I can see it at 100%, 
and LCE makes it more visible.

So, I've always used NR as a first step in processing. Also v. important for 
sharpening and uprezzing.

You say this effect is mainly evident in low ISO images?
It varies, depending on camera and subject, but yes, the Denoise AI Mode with 
settings of 21, 1, 15 mostly works with lower ISOs. But Clear AI often does 
similar wonders on mid range ISOs, then, sometimes, makes objectionable 
artifacts. The beauty of that latest updates is seeing all three right away, 
either offering a pick or clues as to where to make adjustments.

Do you then use Denoise on everything?
Yes. (Sure, there must be exceptions, but the rule prevails.)

If not, why not?

What I have liked about Sharpen AI is that it is still possible to get a
little additional sharpening with FM (usually 1, hardly ever 2).
One oddity of FM, compared to the competition, is the lack of sub-pixel settings. I apply it with 
an Action in PS, which applies it on a new layer. I then adjust opacity for effect. If you see an 
image of mine ending in "oof40", for example,that means I used FM, Out of Focus Mode, 1 
pixel, at 40% opacity. "oofm" means I mixed settings and/or opacity in different parts of 
the image. There will be a downsized PSD file with all the layer details. Classic example would be 
using a setting of 2 only on the eyes, adjusted with painting and/or opacity.
I always read with much interest even if I don't respond.

Thanks! Grumpy moment over. 😁

Life has been rather busy for me and photography has taken a back seat.

But, but - that's just wrong! 😉

Semi-retired and working 10 hours a day consulting. The semi-retired part is I 
only get paid when things work and I get to go bike riding whenever I want.

I retired early. Consulting work helped me through the first few years, but was never as continuous as yours seems to be. Intense, long days, but with long breaks as well.

I have often thought about going through the list and compiling a 
Moose-cheat-sheet for myself.

Oh! Oh! I want one! Sometimes, I run across stuff I did that I'd forgotten 
about. Kind of embarrassing.

You have shown that there is a lot of subtlety to using the latest tools. I 
often use the auto mode in Topaz sharpen except when I see obvious things.

I just tried Auto again. I think they've improved it. Still not always right, 
bit not terribly wrong.

One of the biggest take aways from your recent post, for me, is that crisp is 
not necessarily sharp.

Sharp is not a defined characteristic. It's some often mysterious stew of 
resolution, contrast and edge definition/contrast.

It is much harder to judge when the subject matter is a landscape where one is 
not sure what the original should like like.

Flip side - absent knowledge, just make it look good to you. 😁

I mark emails I later want to come back and review and this post (image link above) was one of 
them: "[OM] DxO PhotoLab 4 DeepPrime Noise Reduction vs Topaz DeNoise  AI" on 10/26/2020 
with "artifacty edginess, whacking the noise, And look at what Clear does for the red and blue 
clothing!" and all. Many observations in my haste I might not notice. Not knowing what a 
subject should look like makes it harder to judge... and I'm looking through my images to find an 
example of that use case...

Another thank you Dr Empiricist

And thank You!!

Better Now Moose

What if the Hokey Pokey *IS* what it's all about?
Options: http://lists.thomasclausen.net/mailman/listinfo/olympus
Archives: http://lists.thomasclausen.net/mailman/private/olympus/
Themed Olympus Photo Exhibition: http://www.tope.nl/

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