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[OM] Re: A recent thread.

Subject: [OM] Re: A recent thread.
From: Nathan <photo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Sun, 25 May 2008 11:00:20 +0200
Larry, I have no idea from where you have the impression that I am  
somehow wealthy and can ignore the cost of fuel and other costs of  
living. I can assure you this is not so. I should also mention that I  
have lived about half of my adult life in the US and half in Europe,  
so I am quite familiar with both systems.

In your argumentation you confuse the individual family's situation  
with the macro level. Of course I do not expect you to run out and  
change jobs or invest thousands in making your home more energy- 
efficient now that gas is $4+ a gallon. But look at the bigger  
picture. Each year, several million new cars are sold in the US. When  
people selected cars back when gas was $1.50/gallon, gas mileage was  
a minor consideration. It is ironic that the US is probably the  
country with the slowest drivers in the Western world (certainly the  
traffic on the interstates is slower than in any of the European  
countries I have lived in) and yet the average engine size is much  
bigger in the US. My wife drives a Toyota Previa minivan--the same  
car is available in the US but with 3.0l and 3.8l engines (at least  
that was the case a few years ago when I looked). But ours, bought in  
Belgium in the 90s, has a 2.4l engine (and manual transmission, not  
typical for minivans but it does make it more efficient too). Still,  
we have no problem travelling at 160 km/h on the motorway. When I was  
buying a new car here in Spain last fall, I looked at mileage as a  
matter of course. It does not mean that I bought a Fiat 500--I ended  
up with a clean diesel Toyota Avensis that cruises comfortably at 180  
km/h on the motorway and has a top speed of 210 km/h. But it does get  
very good mileage doing it, not least thanks to the 6th overdrive gear.

Or take houses: conversion of existing houses to natural gas or solar  
can be difficult and expensive. But as new subdivisions are built,  
the cost of adding such energy efficient features is quite modest,  
and they will become the norm. I am seeing an increasing number of  
solar panels on house roofs here in Alicante. Our gas now costs  
around €1.30/liter, with electricity prices going up 11% on average  
next month and other forms of fossil energy following a similar path.  
Over time, people can and do react rationally to such economic  
incentives. You will not quit your job because the commute is more  
expensive. But each year, millions of Americans do change jobs (for  
all kinds of reasons) and move (also for all kinds of reasons). For  
such people, in this new economic environment, things like distance  
to work, availability of public transport etc. will surely be part of  
the decision process when choosing where to live.

So yes, the $4/gallon gas in the US is not a good thing for the  
individual car driver in the short term, but it is definitely good  
for the environment, for the US society as a whole, and, given the  
size of the US and its greenhouse gas emissions, for the world.

Nathan

On 25-mei-2008, at 10:40, Larry wrote:

>
> It is correlated in the US by what is affordably survivable by most.
> Lower gas prices, but strangling healthcare costs, etc. (that so  
> happen
> to be offered fully by countries with high gas prices) - made this bad
> US system somewhat survivable.  Considering it "good" is exactly what
> someone in your position would intellectualize but can afford it no
> matter what gas ever goes up to.
>
>  Many of us can't just simply make immediate "wiser" choices. We can't
> just hop to another closer job that will come close to covering our
> bills. Simply change the house to a more efficient boiler? Switch  
> to gas
> heat? I don't have the few thousand dollars to quickly do that. Switch
> to wind? Solar? That's many more thousands of dollars.
>
> I realize these amounts of money wouldn't even register to someone
> sought after for major capital restructuring such as yourself, so  
> it is
> purely by academically analyzing the disconnected "big picture"  
> that you
> are saying such things - economics professor or not. People here in  
> the
> US aren't "wasteful" because they are irresponsible. The irresponsible
> wasteful ones here are the ones that are not even affected by these
> increasing gas prices. Gas prices won't affect their lifestyle no  
> matter
> how high they go. The majority that are not in that position need  
> to get
> to whatever job they can get to best cover their costs of living.  
> These
> costs don't as easily allow people to just cavalierly concentrate on
> being as "green" as possibly partly because here they are NOT relieved
> of the fear of keeping themselves and their families healthy. Those
> costs here are obscene, so people need to go where they have to go to
> get work - and in many cases they need a car to do it. Not everyone  
> can
> just choose some set-for-life career with full health coverage just
> because they were simply "smart" enough to make the right "choice"  
> in life.
>
> Many will be on the street before they have a chance to put "wiser"
> choices into practical action.
>
>
> Nathan wrote:
>> Larry,
>>
>> The price of health care has nothing to do with the price of oil. It
>> IS a good thing that gasoline prices have gone up in the US Now the
>> market is doing what no US politician has dared do (increase gas
>> taxes). Good.
>>
>> Nathan
>>
>>
>
>
>
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Nathan Wajsman
Alicante, Spain
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http://www.nathanfoto.com

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