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Re: [OM] [OT] Home automation/security questions and architecture

Subject: Re: [OM] [OT] Home automation/security questions and architecture
From: Scott Gomez <sgomez.baja@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2012 18:00:37 -0700
You're most welcome, Chuck. You might write to the ISY folks and the
smarthome folks regarding camera integration; I don't know the limits or
capabilities on either at present. Of course another, less integrated
approach would be to buy a camera system like some of the self-contained
security camera systems widely available for not much money. Most now have
an interface to the web, and there's an Androi app (for instance) that
knows how to connect to and display output from many of those, as well as
from inexpensive stand-alone IP cameras. Since the ISY, for example, allows
one to set the communications port desired for http or https, one could set
that to an alternate port, and save the "standard" ports for devices
perhaps not as smart. Its how I was (until a router software update from
the Mexican telco seems to have screwed things up) handling having both my
ISY and a cheap ip camera on-line simultaneously. Perhaps I'll have an
opportunity to clear up that little glitch on my trip down there this
coming week.

In my particular case, I intend on using the current house in San Felipe
(very small) and the one here in the US (larger--but still not at all
large) for proving grounds to drive construction (eventually) of a new
house in San Felipe. So the (now two) ISYs are worth the investment. It's
my hope to accomplish a number of things, such as:

1) Simplified wiring, not requiring 2 and 3 way switches (in fact, it's
already possible to have switches that don't have any wiring... and use the
RF to trigger devices on and off).

2) Automation and control of as much energy savings as I can figure out how
to drive. I'd rather not spend my retirement paying ever-increasing energy
costs. Many of the passive systems become, to my way of thinking, far more
viable if one hasn't got to spend a significant amount of time tending them.

3) Integration of solar/wind/whatever that allows local generation and
staying off the grid as much as practical.

Most of those things are moving along and I expect that when the time comes
to build, I'll have enough handle on the programming and operation of the
various controls to be able to design accordingly. While I'm quite
impressed with many of the energy-saving systems I've seen, what seems to
me lacking is a more integrated approach; house as system rather than house
containing systems and sometimes a lack of understanding just how much we
all tend to desire our creature comforts, also.

What I'm hoping also to find along the way is an interested architect or
architecture student that looks at something like this--and other ideas I
have (I'm sure not all of them good... and perhaps even not advisable)--as
an "interesting project" in a climate as harsh as Baja, and with a client
who'd be more than willing to be a bit of a Guinea pig for new ideas.
Frankly, I don't think I've a hope of learning enough regarding building
design before I want to get going on actual construction (still a few years
away) not to need some expert advice from time to time.

---
Scott Gomez

On Fri, Aug 10, 2012 at 6:28 AM, Chuck Norcutt <
chucknorcutt@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Thanks for the good feedback.  I'll have to do a lot more thinking but
> right now I think I can get by with a Smartlinc.  As an ex-programmer I
> like the idea of user-defined variables or having an offset applied to
> sunrise/sunset but think I can do without.  For the first lights on
> event in the morning I would have that based on time of day rather than
> sunrise.  The corresponding off event can also be based on time of day.
>   The second lights on event should be based on sunset and perhaps some
> offset but I think I can handle that by lying to the device about my
> longtitude.  The second lights off events would also be based on time of
> day.  Time of day will, of course, change with daylight savings time but
> I can handle that as long as I have remote access over the net.
>
> So, I think the Smartlinc will handle the lights OK and I haven't had an
> irrigation system for the past 5 years.  But can you think of any
> significant differences with respect to cameras?  If I could get 3-5
> cameras to take a snapshot at least once/day and send me an email with
> photo attached I think that would suffice.  I think I'd assign one of
> them to just watch the thermostat.  Of course, triggering a camera based
> on a loud sound or other event would be even better.
>
> As to watching the thermostat there is also a freeze sensor available
> for use with an Insteon IO Linc but I've been unable to decipher how to
> drive the sending of an email message using that signal like the cameras
> supposedly do.
>
> Chuck Norcutt
>
>
> On 8/10/2012 12:52 AM, Scott Gomez wrote:
> > Perhaps you shouldn't. The major difference between the two, as far as I
> > could see, is in the programming flexibility and capacity. More money:
> more
> > flexibility and capacity. I might have started with a smartlinc had it
> been
> > available a few years ago when I first got interested in this stuff.
> >
> > ISY has some features I don't believe you'll find at all in the
> smartlinc.
> > 1) User-defined variables 2) the ability to base actions on time before
> or
> > after sunrise/sunset 3) the ability to "re-use" programs: one program can
> > call another in the ISY 4) many more conditions available for use in
> > programming. 5) Full integration with ELK security systems. 6)
> Downloadable
> > add-on modules (extra cost) that add capabilities.
> >
> > A simple example: my ISY at the house in Mexico turns on porch lights
> based
> > on "sunset + 15 minutes" rather than simply "at sunset". More complex:
> The
> > sprinklers for the plantings there turn on for a frequency and duration
> > using different programs that I enable/disable based on time of year, and
> > whether the sprinklers are in front of the house (shaded, cool, eastern
> > exposure) or the back (very sunny, hot, western exposure).
> >
> > If you don't feel you'll need those sorts of capabilities then the
> > smartlinc may well be sufficient. Its manual is on line at smarthome.com
> ,
> > I'd suggest looking through it to see if it'll meet your needs. It's a
> heck
> > of a lot less expensive. You'll find the manual for the 99i/994i series
> on
> > line at universal-devices.com.
> >
> > By the way, the folks at UD have proved to be extremely patient, helpful,
> > friendly and quite responsive over the contacts I've had with them. For
> me,
> > that's been a big plus, as initially I had quite a lot of questions, and
> a
> > few years back, there wasn't that much on-line about this stuff. Can't
> say
> > one way or the other with the smarthome support folks, as I've never had
> to
> > use them, since all I've done is purchase devices there.
> >
> > Phases: You'll need probably a minimum of two dual-band devices to handle
> > the phases in the house... depending on how many Insteon devices you plan
> > to employ. Quite easily handled now, as so many devices include dual-band
> > capability. Or bridge the phases as Moose mentioned.
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Aug 9, 2012 at 7:58 PM, Chuck Norcutt <
> chucknorcutt@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> wrote:
> >
> >> First question is why should I spend $300 for an ISY controller rather
> >> than $100 for a simple Smartlink controller?
> >>
> >> Chuck Norcut
> >>
> >>
> >> On 8/9/2012 9:05 PM, Scott Gomez wrote:
> >>> Funny you should ask this now. I've just received my new ISY-994i,
> >> Insteon
> >>> thermostat, and PowerLinc Modem in the mail 2 days ago. Now working on
> >>> programming to accomplish what I want, which is, here in sunny
> >>> too-hot-at-the-moment southern California, using inputs from the "flex
> >> you
> >>> power" alerts that the ISY is capable of reading to tell the thermostat
> >> to
> >>> turn off the air conditioning when a "reduce use" alert is called. Thus
> >>> saving me the per hour double-cost billing now possible thanks to smart
> >>> meters.
> >>>
> >>> 'Tis my second ISY. The other is in our other home in Mexico, where
> it's
> >>> served ably controlling all sorts of goodies.
> >>>
> >>> So ask away, Chuck. I don't know a lot yet (my use has been relatively
> >>> unsophisticated) but I'm learnin'.
> >>>
> >>> ---
> >>> Scott Gomez
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Aug 8, 2012 at 6:53 AM, Chuck Norcutt <
> >> chucknorcutt@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Sorry for breaking the flurry of on-topic OM-D traffic but I have some
> >>>> home automation/security questions for which I know someone here has
> the
> >>>> answers.
> >>>>
> >>>> I have two (I think modest) goals I'd like to achieve for when I leave
> >>>> the house in the winter for warmer climes.
> >>>>
> >>>> 1) Right now I have a simple set of timers that turn a few lights on
> and
> >>>> off that simulate the activity in the house when it's occupied.  Some
> of
> >>>> these timers have a battery backup so they can survive power outages.
> >>>> However, by the time I return in the spring, sunset and sunrise are
> >>>> radically different than when I left.  Also, daylight savings time has
> >>>> gone into effect further throwing the timers off.  Also, one of the
> >>>> lights I'd like to control (but don't now) is operated by a wall
> switch
> >>>> where control is not amenable to a simple plug-in timer.
> >>>>
> >>>> I think I can solve these lighting problems with fairly simple
> Insteon,
> >>>> Z-Wave (or similar) devices.  But I don't know all the ins/outs of
> these
> >>>> things and what's best or worse.  Nor do I completely understand the
> >>>> need for or how to completely cover communicating over both phases of
> >>>> the AC power lines of the house.  That leads to a question of should I
> >>>> use radio transmission devices only?
> >>>>
> >>>> Whatever the solution here it probably gets complicated (cost wise) by
> >>>> goal #2...
> >>>>
> >>>> 2) When I leave the house for the winter I have the plumbing
> winterized
> >>>> with anti-freeze by a plumber right after I leave and de-winterized
> just
> >>>> before I return.  I also have the town turn my water off outside the
> >>>> house just in case my own inside shut-off valve should start leaking.
> >>>> The town turns the water off for free but the
> winterizing/de-winterizing
> >>>> costs me $200/year.  What I'd like to do is get rid of the
> precautionary
> >>>> anti-freeze requirement for the plumbing.  But that requires that I
> keep
> >>>> a close watch on the temperature of the house in the event the furnace
> >>>> should fail.  Right now I have a simple temperature sensor that turns
> on
> >>>> a red light in the window to warn the neighbors if the temperature
> drops
> >>>> to 40F.  But if they don't notice or don't respond the antifreeze in
> the
> >>>> pipes will protect the plumbing.  With no anti-freeze in the pipes I
> >>>> don't dare count on the neighbors noticing that all is not well with
> the
> >>>> furnace.
> >>>>
> >>>> If I want to spend lots of money and use a smartphone (not!) I can get
> >>>> instant alerts via smartphone on some systems.  But I don't want to go
> >>>> there.  I normally have my internet/cable/phone shut off when I'm gone
> >>>> but can leave internet only communications running for about the same
> >>>> amount of money that it costs me for winterizing/de-winterizing.  That
> >>>> allows for a freeze/temperature sensor communicate with me via the net
> >>>> but I don't know exactly how to do that at modest cost.  A warning
> >>>> e-mail would be best but even having to log-on daily for a status
> check
> >>>> would be OK if it's the only way to do it cheaply.
> >>>>
> >>>> These are the functions I'm after.  The questions are how to do it
> >>>> cheaply but also reliably.  If there's no built-in freeze protection
> the
> >>>> system has to work.  Probably best to take the answers to this
> off-list.
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks much,
> >>>> Chuck Norcutt
> >>>> --
> >>>> _________________________________________________________________
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> >>>>
> >>>>
> >> --
> >> _________________________________________________________________
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> >> Archives: http://lists.thomasclausen.net/mailman/private/olympus/
> >> Themed Olympus Photo Exhibition: http://www.tope.nl/
> >>
> >>
> --
> _________________________________________________________________
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> Themed Olympus Photo Exhibition: http://www.tope.nl/
>
>
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